Monday, May 24, 2010

punishment, panties and tears

I like the idea of punishing a man and bringing him to tears through that punishment.What a beginning, don´t you think?

To be honest I have not yet done it, so basically I am talking about a fantasy here, but then, I do fantasize about such a scenario a lot. However, I am not at all into just being brutal to any guy on the street. Actually I am not into being brutal at all!!! And I am not thinking of deliberately hurting someone for no reason at all, just to get me a power flash. I am only talking about "Mr. Right", his punishments and his tears here.

As far as the punishment aspect is concerned: I am only refering to a punishment in a loving, consensual domestic discipline relationship here. A woman who loves her man and thinks that, for some reason, a punishment is needed. A punishment and tears. That is the scenario that interests me. In that context, the idea of bringing my man to tears does have some appeal to me.Why is that?  

First of all, I do very rarely see men cry at all. My brother, in difficult situations, he just walks away and starts writing a poem or a songtext. That is his way of dealing with problems. My clients usually don´t cry in my office and if they do, I actually do put a lot of effort in making them stop crying asap. And I have not even once in 27 years seen my stepfather cry.

My (biological) father however, even though he is questionable in many other aspects of his life, was able to cry in front of me. He did not feel embarrassed. I remember a couple of situations where he did shed tears in front of me. And thinking back at these times, I still have the feeling, that these moments were the most honest and most "intimate" within our sometimes difficult father-daughter relationship.

So basically the fact alone that a man is crying at all is a pretty good indication that something special is going on. And I like everything that is extraordinary. I like the idea that I am witnessing something that only few people were able to see before.

But that is of course not the only reason for my attraction to tears.

Me, personally, I have no problems crying in various situations. And I think crying  is almost always a fantastic way of just letting go of my stress and problems. If I cry, I do not care what other people think of me, I do not pay attention to who is watching and I am absolutely lost in the moment. Crying is an emotional release which I would not want to miss in my life.

Every so often men, even men in dd relationships, report, that their male pride is preventing them from crying in front of their lady. I will make one comment to that remark: Isn´t a big part of  the female led relationship concept about outplaying a mans pride?

There are so many aspects in a female led relationship which are probably not easily to reconcile with the male pride and still, the submissive men are willing and able to deal with it. A good example is the subject of "panties". I am not an expert on the male pride, but I doubt that it is easy  for any men in a "not horny" state to accept or even admit, that he might be obsessed with the panties of his lady. And I do know that there are many men out there who are just that. I once even read about some vending machines in Japan, where men could buy panties that were used by women. Not sure if it is true, but it would not surprise me if that would be the case. So it looks like somehow men can concile that craving with their male pride.

And here comes my question to the men:

I am wondering why it might be easier for submissive men to accept the fact that they dream about the (used) panties of their ladies than to cry in front of the woman they love?

I do not want to  follow the next line of thought too much... but I think it is because the men are still in control when they ask the ladies about their used panties. They want something from the women. The woman is the giver in a way and the man is receiving something he does want to have, even though some men might probably not like the fact that they indeed wanna have the panties... 

If a man cries however, he is the one giving. He is giving away all his emotions and feelings, his sorrow and pain, his guilt and fears.And the woman is the one receiving. She finally gets to see her man in a way nobody else ever does. He shows himself to her unguarded and unprotected. And that is something I love.I love to understand my partner, love to know what he is thinking and feeling and appreciate it very much if he is opening up to me.

And then there is still the fact, that most men are just bigger and taller than their lady. So there is no way for the woman to actually "force" the man to do something or force him to accept a punishment. In a way, a man who submits to his girlfriend or wife for punishment is giving her a great gift. And if he is opening up emotionally so much that he is actually crying, the gift to his woman is even bigger. And yes, I realise that for many men tears do not come easy.

So in a way one could argue that  if a man gets over his male pride and just accepts that the punishment is delivered, that the woman he loves is in charge and that there is indeed no need to repress his tears...that such an attitude does make the man even stronger. I have been told that "submissiveness in its truest essence comes from strength". And I think that is absolutely right, especially if men and tears are concerned.

31 comments:

  1. I don't know if being a sub has anything to do with my ability to cry. I am pretty much an expressive individual, and a strong personality. I've not cried as a result of physical pain since I was wee, but I often find tears for others pain or loss.

    I attended the funeral of a friend of mine's father a week ago. I could not have stopped the tears if I wanted to.

    I once had a girlfriend who ridiculed me for being sensitive. She'd say something hurtful, then mock me for being hurt. Glad I didn't marry that one.

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  2. Jack, I agree, good you did not marry her. Never feel bad for being sensitive.

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  3. Oh, and to answer the question: tears are viewed (by some) as a sign of weakness. I really don't care who sees me cry most of the time, they could tell me that I was weak, but probably don't because I'd hafta kick their ass.

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  4. Jack, I like your attitude :-)

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  5. I cry when I know I have upset my lap. And yes the best is being spanked to tears in panties.

    Honestly.

    Ron

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  6. Tina:
    I have enjoyed reading your blog. I like following your reflection on your fantasies of being in a female-led domestic discipline relationship. You express your thoughts maturely and intelligently, so thank you for sharing them with readers.

    I am in a female-led relationship. In some ways it is like the one you describe, but in one important way it is different - I was the one who brought the idea of this lifestyle to my partner. However, what we experience day to day is much like you describe.

    I have thought about where my dominant and I will be in the future, and actually wrote about it on my blog today. I thought about whether we will be at a point in the future if she will spank me to tears. I am not sure I can cry, but your post makes me realize ways that it would be good for our relationship - to accept the gift of discipline that brings out the parts of me that might keep me from serving to the best of my ability.

    One thing I do have a different perspective than you about. I do not think of this experience as relating to "punishment". I think it is something that is about discipline and correction. That is, I need not do anything "bad" or "wrong" to be spanked or disciplined. Perhaps sometime in the future my dominant will bring me to tears just because she wants to do this for the effect it has upon our relationship.

    Best to you,
    ServingB

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  7. Hello Lawyer,
    I am a spanked male who does cry. I can only speak for myself, of course, but in my case, the tears come not so much from the physical pain, but more from the remorse I feel at having disappointed my wife with my misbehavior.
    As far as the "male pride" is concerned, it seems to me that as I stand there naked in front of her, being lectured and scolded, knowing I'm going to be spanked with a hairbrush, or whipped with a strap, or be given an enema, and/or get my rectal temperature taken, my "male pride" has left me far behind anyway. What pride can I be clinging to. My wife is about to spank me as if I were a 13 year old.
    So, in my case, I cry. Many times I'm crying before the scolding and lecture are over. My wife is very good at scolding and getting me to confess and to admit my guilt. The tears follow freely from there.
    That's not to say that the actual spanking doesn't add to the tears. It does indeed. My wife is a strict and severe disciplinarian who administers her spankings with love and forgiveness but also intense pain. Once she decides I've had enough she will caress and hold me as I regain my composure. We kiss and all is for given.

    JayJay

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  8. Dear Ma’am,

    I like looking at the male slaves wailing because of a pain beaten up merely. It is very much exciting to look at the male slaves’ suffers by their mistress on a video but an experience of a corporal punishment is already other question.

    I got stripes from one of the other mistress in the course of the sessions before our marriage but I did not enjoy the thing always, but the looking at the welts was very stimulant in all cases subsequently. I would consider the caning as foreplay rather if it would depend on me.

    Does fetishist of two kinds exist?

    A female shorts or guardswoman uniform excites me always but only in that case, if a woman dressed in it. If I am looking at them in the shop-window, or at the time of shopping they have an effect on me absolute nothing.

    The amorous men sacrifice their pride and many times even something else on the altar of the love this is known since the age of chivalry.

    It is with a lot more interesting, if the love got cold already, the husbands are capable how many efforts how the new contact should be left secretly (for example Dickens).

    The explanation is plain the women the braver ones... and the harder ones. The women apply this characteristic of theirs against their children only never.

    The good God tested Abraham and not his wife according to the Bible, and the Russian tsar's apology Napoleon the hen-pecked husband acknowledged. The tsar argued with it: "I rule in the realm though, but my wife is the chief at home in the family…”

    regards
    croma

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  9. Tina,

    Thank you for the wonderful blog. It's uncommon to find a woman blogging honestly in the process of becoming a Domme on her own terms (as opposed to having it introduced by her husband or boyfriend). I really enjoy reading your posts.

    As for crying, I definitely agree there is a cathartic release that happens during a good cry.

    I think the answers you are searching for depends a lot on what reason the man has for crying. There are men who were raised to never show tears and as others have cited, that some believe tears imply weakness (I do not agree with that stereotype).

    I have no problem crying, but I've learned to be very careful when and in front of whom, it is okay to cry. Basically, crying in front of certain people can make them feel uncomfortable and react negatively. I have cried in front of my Dommes for various reasons and have learned which ones are okay and which ones are not.

    A few good ones to show in front of her:
    -Crying out of feeling emotionally overwhelmed in a good way. This doesn't happen often but there are times when the bond between us has been so strong it just gave me a sense of peace and that was the result. This went well.

    -Crying out of remorse, guilt, or shame. Tears brought about via punishment are usually appreciated as it shows genuine remorse for the actions leading up to that punishment.

    -Crying out of pain. Not really my thing, but if that's what they wanted...

    -Crying out of discomfort, shame, or humiliation. Again, if this is what they had wanted.

    A bad one to show in front of her:

    -Crying out of sadness, emptiness, or loneliness (for reasons other than due to the loss of a loved one). I have found this to be particularly difficult since the women I have been with have felt responsible and guilty for this. It can lead to a conversation about the problems, but if she gets defensive about it, I've found it usually leads to them taking an emotionally abusive attitude.

    Overall, it is rare to find men who don't feel ashamed when they cry. I can say that I'm less willing to cry in front of her than I was in the past since many times I cry it gets a negative reaction.

    In terms of panty obsession, I think you'll find more submissive men with an obsession for wearing panties than the Japanese panty fetishists.

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  10. Thanks to all for your comments. Tears and crying seem to be a topic that raises many questions. I am not (yet) the one to offer any solutions :-)

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  11. Tina-
    You keep coming up with issues that are both interesting and challenging. In terms of crying, I think it is different from person to person. I really don't think I am 'wired' to easily cry and can't remember ever crying as part of a punishment. However, I completely broke down on the loss of my beloved Springer Spaniel several years ago. Sometimes I tear up while watching a movie.


    Panties: Well, I just love the essence of My Lady. I find that I just can't get enough of her, whether its servicing her directly or when I 'steal' her panties. I am not into wearing them (unless she makes me wear them- thats a different thing) but do love to enjoy her essence. We even have a check box on our 'Notice of Discipline' for panty stealing. Its really a way for me to ask her to discipline me.

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  12. Interesting post! I don't think I've thought about crying and submission too much, at least crying for emmotional reasons. I mean, crying in response to physical pain/puishment is one thing, in response to emmontion is quite different. A very thought provoking post. And panties are very dear to me.

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  13. Perhaps it is cause them men are told not to show their feelings from the start on. Some hundred years ago, when men had to fight man against man, when men had to hunt dangerous beasts, this might haven been necessary. Sometimes i think, this is still very, very deep into our mind. For myself I have experienced, that it is a realy great feeling to let go completely. All the times i was made to cry while being beaten or punished, i felt realy liberated, got very relaxed, something like being born again. Being born without all the packages on my shoulders, i have had to carry. Every time that i was made to cry while being punished, i felt myself realy close to the Lady, felt Her forgiveness and Her love for me. And I made another step towards Her, felt in deeper love with Her. There were no thoughts about weakness at my side, just happiness that She could get behind my walls being able to have a good view at my soul. Proudnes to give Her that filled my mind.

    Please don't be mad about my bad English, but i'm not a native. I'm from Germany and like You a lawyer. Rarely I'm writing in English by myself :)

    Finaly let me tell You, that I realy enjoy reading Your blogg. It shows me, that there is hope to fulfill my dream, to find a strict but caring Woman again. Sometimes I thought, there is no one who is thinking like I do. Who does not only accept a strong willed man, who follows HIS Ladies decisions to the spot, but loves him for being like that. A knight who fights and wins outside, but bends his knees to and follows the instructions from his Queen cause of deep love.

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  14. Tina:

    Not sure you read comments on your older posts but I saw your old post about tears and my reply to it stated:

    "Tina:
    I have thought about where my dominant and I will be in the future, and actually wrote about it on my blog today. I thought about whether we will be at a point in the future if she will spank me to tears. I am not sure I can cry, but your post makes me realize ways that it would be good for our relationship - to accept the gift of discipline that brings out the parts of me that might keep me from serving to the best of my ability.

    One thing I do have a different perspective than you about. I do not think of this experience as relating to "punishment". I think it is something that is about discipline and correction. That is, I need not do anything "bad" or "wrong" to be spanked or disciplined. Perhaps sometime in the future my dominant will bring me to tears just because she wants to do this for the effect it has upon our relationship."


    Well, as you read in my blogs recently, it happened, and it was a wonderful as I predicted it would be. Even better, actually.

    ServingB

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  15. I am married to a wife who spanks me on a regular basis, not directly for infractions. I have been a spankee from the age of 7. Since my wife spanks me (started about 15 years ago) I became more patient, courteous and caring to her. In all those years it only happened twice I cried my eyes out during a spanking and it was in a period I was in a deep state of sadness. I was blocked, built a wall around me.
    After a while my wife sent me to our bedroom to prepare for a spanking, I protested because I was too much busy with myself. My wife insisted. The spanking she gave me was hard and I was determined to take it without any reaction. However the heavy bathbrush on my bare posterior broke me after 40 hard slaps and the tears soon dripped down. She continued the spanking until I howled. Then stopped let me kneel in front of her where she hold me tightly. You could call this 'eine seelische Reinigung'. The release i got from this was amazing.

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  16. Tina,

    Thank you for the opportunity to post a response to your interesting inquiry.

    I used to cry as a result of overwhelming loss, like the death of a loved one or emotional abandonment. I never cry as a result of physical pain no matter how severe. Now I don’t seem to cry at all, even though I have attended the funeral of four close friends these past five years. My not crying has little to do with pride. Death and loss are the natural order of things; I have simply accepted this order.

    As for used women’s panties, I have no interest in them.

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  17. hello Ma'am... i've come across your blog just now and am taken by your writing. i think that beneath it all you seem to be looking for a man that can make a strong emotional connection in relationship where you make the important (and maybe not important) life decisions. i hope you find someone who provides you with what you want, not just someone who enjoys a particular fetish, but someone who can indeed sublimate himself and accept your control, regardless of what it demands. -olivia

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  18. I have cried and do cry when confronted with loss. If someone is spanking me with the intent of hurting me enough to make me cry, I get into a contest of wills and go into a protective mode to take my brain out of the pain. I did start to cry a little bit with a domme earlier this year, and she said something shitty, which led me to practice pain management techniques as a way to deal with the pain. I'm now better at going numb emotionally and physically as a result.

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    1. James, you dont get the beauty of a spanking yet :-)

      It´s not about hurting you and causing you pain.
      In the way I do and see it, a spanking can be a very caring act.

      A loving domme does not want you to get numb. We dont want you to take pain management courses. We dont want you to get into "protective mode"

      Far from it. I want you to get in "opening up" mode. I want you to get in "I am a bit scared and I am on unfamiliar ground here, but I trust you babe, lead me wherever you want to lead me to " mode. I get turned on if a man opens up to me, if he lets me see his struggle. And I want to know if I am asking too much from him. Gregory actually got off my lap one day and told me: "that does not work". His opinion and feelings matter as much as mine. In a scene and outside a scene.

      Sorry the woman said some shitty things to you.

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  19. That's why I like this blog so much. Your approach is unique. I've never seen a DD blog where a spanking is described in the way you described it, and I've never experienced it that way.

    Also, my childhood heavily influences my view of the activity. I'm really not so sure what I'm doing with the whole spanking thing. I've always thought of it as sexualized trauma.

    It used to be fun, but my headspace is very different now. I think it's been somewhat altered by reading too much and seeing too many videos on the Internet which strongly reinforced--not contradicted--how I feel about it (I'm not talking about your blog).

    For me, it's taking myself into a scary and out of control situation and getting through it. It's like the relief comes from surviving it. In my recent scenes, it's been all about proving to myself I can go into the protective mode and come out OK.

    The descriptions and videos I see in other DD sites just don't suggest anything caring to me. They suggest agreed-upon--and often very harsh--retribution for misdeeds. The crying does not sound like a cathartic release because it's accompanied by begging the domme to stop.

    So, I'm driving to do it, but I'm not sure where I'm headed.

    I totally appreciate your approach. It sounds great. I just haven't seen it first hand.

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    1. please do me a favor:

      Don't ever put yourself in a situation with a woman where you are intentionally trying to numb your feelings.

      You deserve to be treated with love and respect. Always.

      Look, eg if you were my boy, I would teach you a lesson about how important it is for you to not let a woman hurt you.
      I would probably even spank you, you would probably even be bare assed over my knees during our talk, but you were 100 % certain that you`d feel so much better afterwards. You ´d feel empowered, loved, cared for, special...

      The spanking subject is obviously in your mind these days, and if you really want another spanking from a domme, make sure it is a woman who knows what she is doing. Negotiate your limits with her, tell her exactly what you want.

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    2. Thanks, Tina. You really are great. If I were with you, I'm sure I'd feel all of that. Gregory is a lucky guy.

      Without loading up your blog with too much detail, the domme in question is very good and is also a good person with good intentions. I've been in the opposite situation (many times), so I'm confident in my assessment.

      My reactions and the numbing etc. are not her doing. She has tried to take things in another direction so I wouldn't feel the need to do that, but last time it did not go well because of something going on with me.

      I'm trying to set up what is going to be a pretty intense (emotionally more than physically) role play with her to let go of some of the feelings that I think are driving all of this. Luckily, she is very smart, experienced, and an excellent communicator. So, it may be unpleasant, but it may work.

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  20. My gut feeling tells me:

    dont go too fast for super intense stuff with the good woman.
    Use the fact that you are trusting her in your advantage. Work on making yourself slowly more comfortable with being dominated by a good woman who cares about you.

    Your fears are probably deeply embedded, stuff from a long time ago. Be gentle with yourself and give yourself some time to adjust to the new you. The you who is not afraid if a woman you trust is in control of you.

    Give her some power over you. Just tiny bits, but big enough pieces that you can actually feel it in your stomach. For instance: Tell her:" in the next week, I want you to send me an email and tell me that I do have an early bedtime today. Send me that email whenever you see fit. I will comply to you, even if I already know today that it will suck". (this is just an example)

    Or tell her:

    "Give me a hand spanking over your knees. It can hurt, but nothing brutal. And tell me 3 things you really like about me, while you are spanking me. Tell me that you are proud of me, while you are spanking me"".

    Tell the good woman: "I am scared, this is all difficult for me. I might emotionally shut down. If you catch me shutting down then stop immediately or slow at least down very much immediately. "

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    1. I dont want you to do anything too unpleasant. This is not an endurance competition. This is not supposed to be difficult and painful and unbearable.

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  21. I've been spanked by her three times already, and we discussed how this would go last week. She really wants me to lay it out in detail.

    This is going to involve me being very verbally harsh towards her in response to being spanked and characterizing what she is doing in a very negative way, which is how I processed (but didn't verbalize it) as a kid. It's going back and standing up for myself verbally even as I endure something that is rough physically. It's a chance to finally say what as an adult I wish I'd said back then. If anything, I've been concerned about her reacting to what I know I'll say because it will be kind of rough. However, she said that she can handle it. This is a pro I'm dealing with, not a romantic partner.

    It was my idea. I don't know if it's a good one or not. I posted it on a board I frequent and didn't get any helpful responses. She said she has done something similar with other people, and it's helped.

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    1. If she is ok with it, and if she is a pro, do it.
      I mean: you are feeling these feelings anyway, why not saying it out loud. I am all for sharing true feelings.

      How is she supposed to react? In you scenario?

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  22. Funny you should say that. She asked me that, and I really don't know. I have to figure out what is helpful. My last inclination was that she would just kind of give up after an extended period without saying much in response to what I've said because that's probably what really would have happened.

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  23. By the way, I greatly appreciate the concern you've shown about this.

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    1. Thanks. I need to get some sleep now. It´s late here. And you got some soul searching to do anyway. You dont need me for that :-)

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  24. there are many different ways she could react...
    -yell back at you
    -apologize to you
    -tell you that you are loved
    -tell you that you are not loved but that you are like your father/or oncle /or whoever-
    -she could start to cry because she switches to being the victim
    -she could tell you that you deserve it
    -she could tell you that she never wants to see you again
    - she could tell you apologetically that she always promised herself to never treat her son like this
    -she could storm out of the room
    -she could silently walk away
    -she could say: I am so sorry and hug you
    ...
    you see there are many scenarios...

    you are the master here. you can decide what you wanna hear.

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  25. That's actually a very helpful list. GĆ¼te Nacht.

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